BIN+CUE versus ISO+MP3

[Jurai]

Originally posted by Taelon@Dec 1, 2003 @ 07:20 PM

Crazygoon, I love you For explaining me and for making as much sense as you do (esp. with burning to CDRW and re-ripping being the safest way to convert an image)

:thumbs-up:

ya burning to cdrw and reripping is the best way to convert, if your a complete dumbass wned

Tagrineth totally owned you guys

 

[mal]

So Crazygoon and Taelon, how does a program like CDMage stuff up an image when converting it?

 

[gameboy900]

Originally posted by Jurai+Dec 1, 2003 @ 07:24 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Jurai @ Dec 1, 2003 @ 07:24 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'> <!--QuoteBegin-Taelon@Dec 1, 2003 @ 07:20 PM

Crazygoon, I love you For explaining me and for making as much sense as you do (esp. with burning to CDRW and re-ripping being the safest way to convert an image)

:thumbs-up:

ya burning to cdrw and reripping is the best way to convert, if your a complete dumbass wned

Tagrineth totally owned you guys [/b][/quote]

I'm just curious if you'll ever let the oportunity pass of completely licking her anus clean with your ass kissing.

 

[CrazyGoon]

Originally posted by Taelon+Dec 1, 2003 @ 07:20 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Taelon @ Dec 1, 2003 @ 07:20 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'>Crazygoon, I love you [/b]

Who doesn't? Oh, wait, Jurai and Tagrineth don't from the sounds of it

<!--QuoteBegin-mal@Dec 1, 2003 @ 08:50 PM

how does a program like CDMage stuff up an image when converting it?[/quote]

Dunno. Never used it. The only time I've converted an image was a nero to cdi (or vise versa), and the program gave a warning to backup the image before converting it, because once converted, the image will never be the same as it once was (even if you convert back). Perhaps the readme file explained it. All I know is that there is a dark cloud looming above convertion tools, and I'm not gonna give them the chance of day to stuff up any of my images. Burning a perfect rip (such as clonecd, nero, bin+cue, and diskjuggler) then ripping to another perfect rip format can't go wrong (unless you burn and rip at fast speeds).

 

[mal]

Nah, CDMage rocks.

Unfortunately it seems to be dead - it hasn't been updated in a couple of years.

 

[King M]

fyi: i have nice plextor cd-rw drive

cdi is crap because: disc image is not the same as the disc. i've done tests on sega cd games and data in some sectors in the image does not mach the data in the same sectors on the disc. also, its a proprietary format. there has been at least 1 major revision in the format, causing version 2 images to not be usable with version 3 of dj. ya never know when they might decide to change it again.

nrg is crap because: see above about data inconsistency. also a proprietary format. i've heard there were changes in the format towards the end of the version 5 run, but i haven't confirmed. also, nero 6 apparently can't handle multisession images or something.

bin/cue is good because: all the necessary data is there, and in the right place. NOT a proprietay format, just the data and indeces. there's not much to change there. that also means any burning program that's worth a damn can make cd's from bin/cue images (exception is blindwrite, sega cd games won't boot). cdrwin and blindread do their job and do it right. alcohol creates a proper bin, but the cuesheet is wrong from track 03 on (concerning sega cd games).

clonecd is undetermined because: it's a bin/cue when you get down to it. for sega cd games, all the sub stuff is unnecessary. the problem is that last time i tested it for ripping, there was an extra frame in an odd spot. i never bothered to try again so that's not a total negative, it could be a fluke. if the ripper doesn't create a cuesheet, that's annoying. make a goddamn cuesheet so i can use cdrwin.

iso/mp3 is crap because: it's sloppy and there's quality loss. if you don't care about integrity, then it can serve it's purpose with proper encoding and all that. for everyone else, full images are necessary.

iso/wav is crap because: why bother? leave it as a bin/cue and be done with it.

as for losing cuesheets, how the hell do you do that? it's not like rippers send the bin and cue's out seperately. maybe you randomly split up file sets and place them around your hard drive, but most people don't. if you somehow manage to get a bin without a (necessary) cue, don't share it. if you have an archive with a bin and a cue, dont extract it and share the open contents. don't repack them and share the new archive either. that's just dumb.

http://segacd.org

 

[Jurai]

Originally posted by gameboy900+Dec 1, 2003 @ 10:33 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(gameboy900 @ Dec 1, 2003 @ 10:33 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'>

Originally posted by Jurai@Dec 1, 2003 @ 07:24 PM

<!--QuoteBegin-Taelon

@Dec 1, 2003 @ 07:20 PM

Crazygoon, I love you For explaining me and for making as much sense as you do (esp. with burning to CDRW and re-ripping being the safest way to convert an image)

:thumbs-up:

ya burning to cdrw and reripping is the best way to convert, if your a complete dumbass wned

Tagrineth totally owned you guys

I'm just curious if you'll ever let the oportunity pass of completely licking her anus clean with your ass kissing. [/b][/quote]

thats rude and disrespectful guy. i was just pointing out that she has repeatedly owned ppl in this thread by using actual information instead of blabbering on about how mp3s are teh rox, or how isos r da bomb cuz i said so

also they would have to be french kisses to do that

 

[King M]

Originally posted by Tagrineth@Dec 1, 2003 @ 07:21 PM



-edit: And in case you're talking about dual data track games - again, that doesn't help if all the places where I can get the discs without resorting to buying an original (and just fyi, I do own NiGHTS, for one) provide them in iso/iso/mp3. It's good and all when you use full-featured formats for your own purposes, but it doesn't do anyone else any good, which is the biggest issue here above everything else.

i believe the issue is which format is best for ripping games, not which game you can currently get in whatever format from whichever server.

perhaps someone will notice the thread and realize iso/iso/mp3 sucks and wil find a full image and share that instead. or perhaps you could rip your copy and share with others.

 

[mal]

I don't know what all the noise concerning NiGHTS is about anyway. (Not that it's been a big part of this discussion)

It's neither rare nor expensive.

 

[slacker52]

Originally posted by Tagrineth@Nov 30, 2003 @ 02:02 PM

Once again: That. Doesn't. Help. If. The. Game. Is. Already. Provided. In. Iso/iso/mp3. Format.

How bloody stubborn are you I never said I was ripping BURNED CDs!

I rip originals you fool

[tag]What's your point with this one? I didn't say you were ripping burned discs.

Tagrineth says one thing to try to show some dude how smart she can be, but no it didnt even touch the guys ear. this my friends, is how married couples become...un-married.

fyi, NiGHTS was fun for about a day, then it sux.

but the fun dont stop. tell me what yall think of these stats im thowing out of my prat(or the bits and pieces of info in this thread) out of 5

catagories= (whats the word for non-proprietary)

Works

Accuracy

nrg

no

****

****

cdi

no

***

****

iso/music

yes

*****

***

bin/cue

yes

*****

****

img/ccd/sub

no

****

****

feul to the fire i supose

btw, not to be a colin cleaner, but Tagrineth, you do seem much to smart to be hanging around in a pllace filled with so many idiots.

 

[Taelon]

Wow, this thread is filled with a lot of hate.

As for Tagrineth (surprised to find out he's a she), can't even take her seriously anymore. <_< Sure I could prove that an iso/wav image can be perfect, only done it 1,000 times but why bother at this point?

Anyway, all of you saying that iso/wav is pointless are of course right. I was just talking about it hypothetically anyway the true point of contention is that iso/mp3 is always a flawed image and that is of course 100% correct. All I ever had the intention of saying was that I love iso/mp3s because they come very close to being good images while saving a lot of space

The purists among you please go ahead and stick with bin/cue I have no problem with that

Oh, and mal, never said anything was wrong with CDmage It's saved me a lot of times

Now can we all just give each other a group hug? lol

 

[CrazyGoon]

Originally posted by King M+Dec 2, 2003 @ 02:08 AM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(King M @ Dec 2, 2003 @ 02:08 AM)</div><div class='quotemain'>perhaps someone will notice the thread and realize iso/iso/mp3 sucks and wil find a full image and share that instead. or perhaps you could rip your copy and share with others.[/b]

As long as the 'copy' you are refering to is an original and not a burnt 'copy'

Originally posted by King M@Dec 2, 2003 @ 01:41 AM

as for losing cuesheets, how the hell do you do that?

Don't know I think some fools share bins w/out cues on edonkey though. People download them and spread them without knowing they are missing the cue. Other than that, you will certainly find the cue's with the bins at SX.

Originally posted by mal@Dec 2, 2003 @ 02:49 AM

I don't know what all the noise concerning NiGHTS is about anyway. (Not that it's been a big part of this discussion)

It's neither rare nor expensive.

Is been used as examples often when it comes to ripping and burning, because it has two data tracks. That's why it was mentioned just now aswell

As for the Tagrineth/ Taelon debate, I think both understand what the other was trying to say now, and it's a joke, really. I think most people understand that (well, I don't think slacker52 does).

Or am I all wrong?

<!--QuoteBegin-Taelon@Dec 2, 2003 @ 05:43 AM

Now can we all just give each other a group hug?[/quote]

Yep. Where's the group hug smiley?

 

[mal]

Originally posted by CrazyGoon+Dec 2, 2003 @ 10:53 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(CrazyGoon @ Dec 2, 2003 @ 10:53 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteBegin-mal@Dec 2, 2003 @ 02:49 AM

I don't know what all the noise concerning NiGHTS is about anyway. (Not that it's been a big part of this discussion)

It's neither rare nor expensive.

Is been used as examples often when it comes to ripping and burning, because it has two data tracks. That's why it was mentioned just now aswell

[/b][/quote]

No I mean in terms of the number of questions posed about how to burn NiGHTS.

Sure there haven't been many lately, but there have been plenty in the past.

 

[gameboy900]

Originally posted by Jurai+Dec 2, 2003 @ 02:03 AM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Jurai @ Dec 2, 2003 @ 02:03 AM)</div><div class='quotemain'>

Originally posted by gameboy900@Dec 1, 2003 @ 10:33 PM

Originally posted by Jurai@Dec 1, 2003 @ 07:24 PM

<!--QuoteBegin-Taelon

@Dec 1, 2003 @ 07:20 PM

Crazygoon, I love you For explaining me and for making as much sense as you do (esp. with burning to CDRW and re-ripping being the safest way to convert an image)

:thumbs-up:

ya burning to cdrw and reripping is the best way to convert, if your a complete dumbass wned

Tagrineth totally owned you guys

I'm just curious if you'll ever let the oportunity pass of completely licking her anus clean with your ass kissing.

thats rude and disrespectful guy. i was just pointing out that she has repeatedly owned ppl in this thread by using actual information instead of blabbering on about how mp3s are teh rox, or how isos r da bomb cuz i said so

also they would have to be french kisses to do that [/b][/quote]

I have no real problems with you or her. It's just that it seems like every thread I read where she responds to someone you seem to chime in with a "yeah she told you so/she owned you" post. It's getting a bit annoying.

 

[Jurai]

Originally posted by gameboy900+Dec 2, 2003 @ 02:29 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(gameboy900 @ Dec 2, 2003 @ 02:29 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'>

Originally posted by Jurai@Dec 2, 2003 @ 02:03 AM

Originally posted by gameboy900@Dec 1, 2003 @ 10:33 PM

Originally posted by Jurai@Dec 1, 2003 @ 07:24 PM

<!--QuoteBegin-Taelon

@Dec 1, 2003 @ 07:20 PM

Crazygoon, I love you For explaining me and for making as much sense as you do (esp. with burning to CDRW and re-ripping being the safest way to convert an image)

:thumbs-up:

ya burning to cdrw and reripping is the best way to convert, if your a complete dumbass wned

Tagrineth totally owned you guys

I'm just curious if you'll ever let the oportunity pass of completely licking her anus clean with your ass kissing.

thats rude and disrespectful guy. i was just pointing out that she has repeatedly owned ppl in this thread by using actual information instead of blabbering on about how mp3s are teh rox, or how isos r da bomb cuz i said so

also they would have to be french kisses to do that

I have no real problems with you or her. It's just that it seems like every thread I read where she responds to someone you seem to chime in with a "yeah she told you so/she owned you" post. It's getting a bit annoying. [/b][/quote]

cuz she did

 

[Tagrineth]

Originally posted by Taelon@Dec 2, 2003 @ 05:43 AM

Wow, this thread is filled with a lot of hate.

As for Tagrineth (surprised to find out he's a she), can't even take her seriously anymore. <_< Sure I could prove that an iso/wav image can be perfect, only done it 1,000 times but why bother at this point?

So this 'proved 1,000 times'... can you point me to any single one of those?

And in fact, have you *PROVED* beyond a shadow of a doubt that every track is aligned to the frame?

Just sticking a game in the console, booting it, and hearing audio - is no proof of a 'perfect' burn.

And of course, once again, all I'm hearing (at least in this quote) is "OH BUT IM STILL RIGHT!!!1! NEENER NEENER", with still no proof. I don't even know why I'm posting this, despite saying I wouldn't.

 

[Taelon]

I didn't prove it 1,000 times. I said I had DONE it 1,000 times. (Exaggerated the number there anyway)

Yes, every track is aligned to the frame. Not much to it. In every other CD image format, tracks are aligned to the frame, why wouldn't an iso/wav, since both the .iso track and the .wav files come out to multiples of 2048 and 2352, respectively?

Oh, and the I'M STILL RIGHT, NYAH, NYAH isn't coming from me. That's your own echo you're hearing. :lol:

Really amusing, the whole thread.

[Edited for spelling mistakes]

 

[IBarracudaI]

lol...

Started with iso+mp3 vs bin+cue and now "we're" discussing frames

People just want to play the games....

 

[Tagrineth]

Originally posted by Taelon@Dec 4, 2003 @ 01:57 AM

Yes, every track is aligned to the frame. Not much to it. In every other CD image format, tracks are aligned to the frame, why wouldn't an iso/wav, since both the .iso track and the .wav files come out to multiples of 2048 and 2352, respectively?

Oh, and the I'M STILL RIGHT, NYAH, NYAH isn't coming from me. That's your own echo you're hearing. :lol:

Really amusing, the whole thread.

What app did you use to check the track alignment?

And why wouldn't they be aligned perfectly? Well, first off, CDDA is ALWAYS 2352 bytes per sector, except in kinda rare cases (or in early game discs before mix-mode 2048/2352 was defined, but not many of those exist). Second, since you have several SEPARATE FILES, there can easily be inaccuracies when ripping a CD (I've experienced this myself, sometimes the start/end times of tracks can be slightly off), there can be inaccuracies BURNING a CD (sometimes the burning application attempts to correct bits it sees as 'incorrect'). I can give a perfect example right now - any Sega Saturn ISO/WAV or ISO/MP3 burned using Alcohol 120% *will* have screwed audio, no questions asked.

Simple enough answers for you? I've given you reason after reason why alignment could VERY VERY EASILY be off. The burden of proof is on you, hun, and I don't see any of it anywhere.

And Barracuda, if "people just want to play the games..." was entirely the case, this thread wouldn't have started in the first place.

 

[Taelon]

Burden of proof on me? HAH. Listen, "hun", just because you're experienced in screwing it up as many ways as you have just described doesn't mean jack

Besides, I said already that CDDA audio is 2352 bytes/sector, you're just restating me

EDIT: Almost forgot. I have in the past compared original CDs and copies burned from iso/wav sets via ISOBuster. In each case, all the start/end offsets for all the tracks were identical.